Although many Christians are talking about the church, we must ask them where their church is. Most Christians do not dare say that the church is in the Roman Catholic Church or in any of the denominations. Fifty years ago, they might have had the boldness to say this, but not today, because the light of the truth is shining in the darkness, and eyes are being opened to see that Catholicism and the denominations certainly are not the church. Neither would anyone have the boldness to claim that a free group is the church. Free groups are free groups, not the church. An apple is an apple, and a peach is a peach. You cannot call a peach an apple, for everything must have its own name. The denominations are the denominations, the free groups are the free groups, and the church is the church. Therefore, we are still left with the question, where is the church?
Many, finding it difficult to answer this question, may reply, “The church is heavenly and spiritual, and all Christians are in it.” This sounds good, and I have heard it time and time again. In the past, people who spoke with me did not dare say that the church is in Catholicism, in denominations, or in the free groups. They had been enlightened to see that none of these things is the church. Therefore, they said, “The church includes every saved one, so it must be heavenly and spiritual; it is not on earth.” But I want something practical. Do not talk about money if you do not have even one dollar. I would rather you give me a dollar, than talk vainly to me about a million dollars. Therefore, with those who say that the church is merely heavenly and spiritual, I always press this question: “Where is your church? You say that the church includes every saved one. Are you not a saved one? I am certain that you are a dear brother. According to your definition of the church, every saved one is in the church. Where is your church right now?” As I speak to them in this frank manner, they dare not say, “My church is the Methodist ‘church.’” In ordinary conversation they might say that they go to the Methodist “church,” but when it comes to the truth concerning the church, no one dares to talk like this. Anyone who talks in this way would immediately lose his case. Deep within, they know that neither the Methodist denomination nor any other denomination is the church. Finding it difficult to answer my question in a definite way, many have said, “Brother Lee, the church is heavenly and spiritual. But we are still in the flesh on earth. Although we are saved and belong to the church, the church is not here today. It is impossible to have something so heavenly and spiritual on earth today. We must wait until we go to heaven. Then we will all be spiritual and we will be practically in the church.” My answer to this is very simple: “Brother, if this is the case, then let us no longer talk about the church. What is the use in doing so? According to your definition, there can be no church on earth today, but only in heaven in the future.” After hearing this, they have said, “Oh, I don’t mean that.” Then I responded, “Please tell me what you mean by saying that the church is heavenly and spiritual and that it cannot be found among humans on earth. Doesn’t this mean that there is no church on earth today? You have said that the church includes all the believers. Since this includes you, please tell me where the church is. I don’t want doctrine. I’m like a hungry person who wants something to eat. I’m not asking for a fancy dinner. Just give me a slice of bread. You say that the church is heavenly. That is the nature of the church. But where is the church located? Brother, by your own word, it is clear that, speaking in a practical way, you are not in the church. If you were in the church in a practical way, you could immediately tell me where the church is. You could say, ‘This is the church where I am.’ Brother, we must be practical.”